Richard, as you (and the manual) have said, the steering gear is centered when the notch in the shaft is straight down. I wouldn't worry about some difference in turns to left vs. right. You're right that the play should be minimal when the gear is centered. I'm inclined to think the problem may be in the respective tie-rod lengths, i.e., the steering mechanism "beyond the drag link" isn't truly centered.

I agree with Park. Also, if it's not self-centering, that is often attributed to a negative caster angle, i.e., too much over-steer. Also, radials don't self-center the way bias plies do. Do you have radials?

Rob.

If you have the wheels pointing straight ahead, with the car not moving, how much free play is there in the steering wheel? If there is almost none, the steering box is adjusted properly. I am assuming that the notch is pointing down when the wheels are pointing straight ahead.

To see if the steering box is centered when the notch is pointed down, disconnect the drag link from the pitman arm. See how much play there is by wiggling the pitman arm. Try moving the steering wheel to various positions and checking the play. If the play is least when the notch is pointing down, then that is where the steering tube should be for straight ahead driving. My 1951Hudson manual says that there should be 1/32 inch movement of the pitman arm when the steering box is at its least play position.

Assuming that the least play position is with the notch is pointing down, then the steering wheel should be removed and repositioned so the center spoke is pointing down when the notch is pointing down.

If the wheels are not pointing straight ahead at the "least play/notch down" position, adjustment can be made as Park said with the tie rods, or as you said, with shims in the drag link.

Per

Park and Russ,

Thank you!

I do have radials.
Modern cars tend to have more caster to handle the radial tires, to help with self centering. If everything else doesn't help I'll try more caster.

Rob

Per,

Thank you!

Yes, the notch is straight down. There is very little play, an inch or so.

When the alignment was done, I made sure the notch was straight down (steering wheel was off to the side, but notch was down)
While driving in a straight line, the notch is straight down (I marked the notch position on the horn ring with a paint dot)
Your instructions for determining if the notch position matches the tight/center spot on the gearbox is what I was after.
Off to do more testing...

Rob

Rob,

Some time ago you experimented with various tire pressure in the front wheels. Was there any difference in self-centering of the steering with tire pressure?

Per

HI, Rob we met at national you drove my car
I think your gear box is no good, i have two boxes i put them in the vise and turned them thay turn six turns lock to lock three turns is center
box is tight, turn it a 1/4 it just a little bit loser a 1/2 a little more and so on and so on, you said that you box was center at 2 1/4 one way and 2 3/4 the other way thats not right maybe your box was worked on and repeard with mis-matched parts but something s not right, I would pull drag link off gear box turn gear box lock to lock and center, then grab pit arm wiggle it lightly see if its set right your look;ng for that 1/32, to tight is not good if it checks out ok and wheel is not right it may have been mis marked, if it is junk and you cant find a good one close you can have one of mine for shipping cost.
good luck Dan

Per,

Adding pressure to the tires helped slightly with stability, but didn't do anything for centering that I could tell.

It did make for a harsh ride...

Rob

Dan,

I'm going to pull the drag link this weekend and determine once and for all if the box is the culprit.
I remember on my Model A the box was as you describe; very snug in the center, and a bit looser as you went away from center.

Thank you for your offer, it is very much appreciated.
Did you get the E mail from me a couple weeks ago, with the pictures you requested?
Thanks too for the great deal on the flywheel. It cleaned up like new in the blast cabinet, is now painted and ready to install when needed! 🙂

Rob

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That is a great picture of the flywheel advance markings. Much clearer than what is in my Mechanical Procedure Manual. How many degrees advance from TDC does each line represent.?
Lee O'Dell

Rob,

Perhaps something in the suspension limits how far you can turn the wheel. When you have the drag link disconnected, you can check your box with Dan's measurements to see if the box goes six turns.

There is also the possibility of end play in the steering shaft. This is checked by seeing if you can pull the steering wheel towards you and away from you. From what I see in the manual, it is adjusted with shims.

Thanks for the reply concerning radial tires self-returning.

Per

Lee and Per,

Thanks, I don't know how many degrees it is between marks...

I've been camping for the last couple days with the boys, hope to work on the car today or tomorrow, will let you know what I find.
Thank you for all your assistance.

Rob

Lee,

I made measurements on Rob's picture, and got between 10 and 12 degrees across the four divisions, therefore between 2.5 and 3.0 degrees for each division.

Rob,

If you want to measure it more accurately, this is what I did:

1. Measure the diameter. I chose the diameter at the inner end of the lines, since it is close to the circle made by the bulging part of the flywheel. I used millimeters to make calculations easier than inches and fractions.

2. Multiply the diameter by Pi (I used 3.1416 for Pi).

3. Measure the distance across all the lines, at their inner ends.

4. Divide step 3 by step 2.

5. Multiply step 4 by 360. This gives the number of degrees for the four divisions.

6. Divide this by 4 to get the number of degrees between two lines.

Per

Per,

Thank you for the instructions, I'll give it a shot tomorrow.

I got the drag link off and found that the steering box is centered when the notch is straight down.
I also found that there are 6 full turns, and three full turns from center. This is slightly different from when the drag link was connected.
Can anyone tell me what the position of the pittman arm is when the steering is centered? Mine is not pointing straight down...if it is supposed to be.
Also, could anyone measure the length of the drag link on a Hornet, and or on a Wasp?
Wondering if parts might have been switched.

The gearbox, when tested by grabbing the pittman arm is pretty snug.
The steering wheel is not dragging when run through its range, and I adjusted tighter and looser on the gearbox side adjustment to be sure.
The wheels/steering system, when run side to side by hand, disconnected from the gear box and pittman arm, moves fairly freely though its range. I'm not sure how "loose" it is supposed to be?

Rob